"endless love" and " dreaming of you"

**captainjames** · 02-25-2014, 08:56 AM

Always felt it odd that these two legends only recorded two songs together. Does anyone know why ?

**reese** · 02-25-2014, 10:39 AM

It might have been because they knew they could never repeat the success of ENDLESS LOVE, and would like to leave that as their shining moment. The days of artists doing multiple duets like the Supremes/Tempts or Marvin and Tammi were basically over by this time.

Also, Diana has mentioned that although she loves Lionel, he wasn't easy to work with in terms of punctuality. She did say that she loved working with his co-producer James Carmichael, with whom she recorded some tracks in the 90s. And of course, she and Lionel did get together again for MISSING YOU.

supremester · 02-25-2014, 01:49 PM

As Miss Ross' most ardent fan [[or one of them, anyway) I know I could have my Rossnosity Card revoked for saying this, but WTF is so great about Endless Love? The song? the vocal? The track? It's greatness escapes me totally - it always has.

RossHolloway · 02-25-2014, 03:16 PM

I think the primary reason why they did not record any news songs after it became a monster hit was because DR left Motown later that year in 1981.

**jobeterob** · 02-25-2014, 04:48 PM

As the years have gone on, I've appreciated Endless Love more and more and often watch the version they sang at the Academy Awards on Youtube.

**antceleb12** · 02-25-2014, 04:56 PM

Originally Posted by supremester

As Miss Ross' most ardent fan [[or one of them, anyway) I know I could have my Rossnosity Card revoked for saying this, but WTF is so great about Endless Love? The song? the vocal? The track? It's greatness escapes me totally - it always has.

I've always hated "Endless Love," too. Too cheesy!

**JohnnyB** · 02-25-2014, 06:23 PM

Originally Posted by supremester

As Miss Ross' most ardent fan [[or one of them, anyway) I know I could have my Rossnosity Card revoked for saying this, but WTF is so great about Endless Love? The song? the vocal? The track? It's greatness escapes me totally - it always has.

As another of Miss Ross' most ardent fans, I agree with Supremester. The success of Endless Love made me very proud; the song was everywhere in the summer and fall of 1981, and for that reason I love it and the momentum the song added to her career. But it has never been a favorite of mine...

RossHolloway · 02-25-2014, 06:38 PM

I actually prefer her solo version of EL from her Why Do Fools album.

**sophisticated_soul** · 02-25-2014, 06:49 PM

Originally Posted by RossHolloway

I actually prefer her solo version of EL from her Why Do Fools album.

Same here. For me the duet version got old fast, but I still love the solo version.

supremester · 02-25-2014, 07:59 PM

I remember thinking that she was so good at The Pantages that I finally got Endless Love. That being said, I'd rather have Turn Me Over in the show.

smark21 · 02-25-2014, 09:27 PM

I wish Turn Me Over would become a permanent part of her show--extended version complete with twerking.

**captainjames** · 02-25-2014, 10:05 PM

Endless love was the perfect wedding, summer of love, breakup, fall in love and all around feel good sound. Even though, Diana was on her way out the door I can not believe Motown did no try and get more.

**vgalindo** · 02-26-2014, 02:12 AM

I love when Diana sings Endless Love in concert. It gives me goose bumps. I also love the recording. Her vocals are so crystal clear and beautiful.

**vgalindo** · 02-26-2014, 02:16 AM

I love when Diana sings Endless Love in concert. It gives me goose bumps. I also love the recording. Her vocals are so crystal clear and beautiful. It was her best performance of her Central Park concert. I wore my recorded video tape out watching her sing Endless Love over and over from Central Park.

**marv2** · 02-26-2014, 02:36 AM

Originally Posted by captainjames

Always felt it odd that these two legends only recorded two songs together. Does anyone know why ?

He, Lionel Richie did not like her. He said "Everyone was friendly..except for Diana Ross ..."

http://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/enterta...-diana-1012002

He said that she was "aloof".

http://www.lipstickalley.com/showthread.php?t=176375

This is probably the main reason he would have nothing else to do with her.

supremester · 02-26-2014, 03:55 AM

Actually, he'd have nothing else to do with YOU. Because, like a certain idol of yours, are both degenerate liars. He never said he didn't like her or that she wasn't friendly. Here is the full, exact quote:

"Diana was the most aloof of all the Motown acts. You didn't have access to her. The Temptations or The Four Tops would hang out in the hallway but Diana didn't. She'd come out of her car, go straight into the studio....................... "She had a 40th birthday party and I got an invitation. My father couldn't believe it when I took him along and he came face to face with all these Motown legends."

When did he want nothing more to do with her exactly?
Was it after she didn't hang in the halls at Hitsville in Detroit in 1970?

Was it after he cut two tracks - including the biggest of his career with her in 1981?

Was it after she declined to record a follow up in 1982?

Was it after he went to her party in 1984?

Was it after he wrote and recorded the smash Missing You on her in 1984?

Was it after We Are The World in 1985?

Was it he cut two tracks on her in 1998 that she didn't include in an album yet?

Was it after he tried to get her to tour with him in 2009, 2010 & 2011?

WHEN exactly did he decide this - or was it after Flo interrupted Diane and monopolized the rest of the conversation giving clever and honest answers to the rest of Carson's questions?

No wonder you idolize her so much - you two are exactly alike and love making things up, exaggerating and misrepresenting facts in order to besmirch others. CLUE: If she is really as bad as you say, you two wouldn't have to make things up - you could just rely on the truth. Imagine that.....just telling it how it is - what a concept! It looks kind of desperate and crazy to be "inventful" when talking about other individuals - especially one you don't know. LOL!

Sugar Pie, Honey Bunch - you just can't help yourself!

Well, please excuse me but I have to go. [[Michelle Obama and I are having lunch on Pluto tomorrow and I have to pick out what she's gonna wear.) Goodnight xo

**captainjames** · 02-26-2014, 08:15 AM

Supremester you ROCK !!!

**captainjames** · 02-26-2014, 08:23 AM

Also I would love to hear those tracks that were recorded i 1998

RossHolloway · 02-26-2014, 10:05 AM

Originally Posted by captainjames

Supremester you ROCK !!!

What CaptainJames said!

**JohnnyB** · 02-26-2014, 05:38 PM

Originally Posted by captainjames

Supremester you ROCK !!!

I second that emotion!!!

**skooldem1** · 02-26-2014, 06:45 PM

I like the song because of the way they sing it. They don't compete with each other. They sing to each other. Their voices really compliment each other. One of my favorite parts is the final verse following the "bom boms", when they sing "and love, I'll be a fool for you, I'm sure" and then Diana sings "you know I don't mind, I don't mind" [[at 3:34 in the video below). The way she sings "you know I don't mind, I don't mind", is sublime. She has completely surrendered to love. I love that lyric. Love will make a fool of you sometimes. Then she continues on and the way she sings "and yes [[you'll be the only one) cause". The way she sings those highlighted words are perfect. It is a declaration of love, and she really conveys that. The end verse when they sing together, Lionel's voice is so convincing when he declares "I'll give it all to you my love...and then Diana's perfect response and ending to the song "my love, my love". Is another perfect moment in this song. I always felt that Diana's vocal wasn't pushed out front enough in production, but it does add a certain warmth to the overall feel of the song. Here is a great youtube video of just Lionel and Diana's vocal without the music. You can really hear how great they sound together. Listen to the vocals.

**whitesoxx** · 02-26-2014, 07:27 PM

Lol Supremester! As Joan Rivers used to say: Look how quiet the room got! ;-)

**DianaLove** · 02-26-2014, 07:51 PM

Originally Posted by skooldem1

I like the song because of the way they sing it. They don't compete with each other. They sing to each other. Their voices really compliment each other. One of my favorite parts is the final verse following the "bom boms", when they sing "and love, I'll be a fool for you, I'm sure" and then Diana sings "you know I don't mind, I don't mind" [[at 3:34 in the video below). The way she sings "you know I don't mind, I don't mind", is sublime. She has completely surrendered to love. I love that lyric. Love will make a fool of you sometimes. Then she continues on and the way she sings "and yes [[you'll be the only one) cause". The way she sings those highlighted words are perfect. It is a declaration of love, and she really conveys that. The end verse when they sing together, Lionel's voice is so convincing when he declares "I'll give it all to you my love...and then Diana's perfect response and ending to the song "my love, my love". Is another perfect moment in this song. I always felt that Diana's vocal wasn't pushed out front enough in production, but it does add a certain warmth to the overall feel of the song. Here is a great youtube video of just Lionel and Diana's vocal without the music. You can really hear how great they sound together. Listen to the vocals.

I completely agree with you on this.
Admittedly I have felt it is such a cheesy and overplayed song. Everyone knows it and I often feel like they're missing out on so many better songs that she has to offer. However as you point out so eloquently, from a vocal performance standpoint it is really one of the best pop vocal performances ever and I really think the passion, eloquence and sincerity this song is performed with contributed to its monster success. If two other people had sang this song it may have laughed off the radio and been long forgotten.

supremester · 02-26-2014, 09:21 PM

Thank you for the vocal only - it IS a great performance. The reason, I believe, that she declined to do another duet at the time is cuz she had just endorsed a checque for over 20 million and wanted to respect RCA, without having to haggle with Berry to use Lionel on her label. Also, there was a concept [[Silk Electric) at the time that I think might have excluded such gems as "Oh! - what a feeling! [[when you're dancing on the ceiling)" ......give me Turn Me Over any day over that stuff. He has a huge following and I'm glad so many love his music, I'm just not one of them. I actually prefer many Yoko tracks to his. I do think All Night Long was a great production, but I don't know if he did that or not.

**carole cucumber** · 02-26-2014, 11:54 PM

Originally Posted by skooldem1

I like the song because of the way they sing it. They don't compete with each other. They sing to each other. Their voices really compliment each other.........

One factor hasn't yet fully entered the conversation- the circumstances leading up to and the recording of Endless Love. Jon Peters, producer and Franco Zeffirelli, director were looking for an instrumental piece of music to use as the theme for the motion picture, 'Endless Love', that they were creating. Lionel Richie was approached and offered the instrumental track of "Endless Love". After hearing Lionel's submission, Franco asked to hear lyrics for the song. Lionel had none at that point. Franco also decided that a female singer, someone like Diana Ross, should sing the song.Eventually R.C.A. & Motown worked out a deal to allow DianaRoss & Lionel Richie to participate. According to 'The Billboard Book of Numbe One Hits':"Diana's schedule didn't allow any time to fly to Los Angeles and Richie was too busy with the next Commodores album and his work with Kenny Rogers to leave the city. the problem was solved when Diana played Lake Tahoe, Nevada. Lionel agreed to meet her in Reno, about an hour away by automobile. Studio time was booked for 3 a.m. , allowing Lionel to fly up after a recording session and Diana to drive in after her 1 a.m. show."This lady did not have any lyrics prior to the session", Richie told Dick Clark in a Mutual Broadcasting Special. "She just had the melody. I said I'll bring the lyrics with me. At 3:30 in the morning we started singing. At 5 o'clock in the morning we had'Endless Love' down on tape."

**carole cucumber** · 02-27-2014, 12:10 AM

With regards to the other duet, "Dreaming Of You", in 'Lionel Richie' by Roberta Plutzik.:
"[[Jon) Peters set up a meeting at which Lionel would meet [[Franco) Zeffirelli, who had directed the classic film Romeo and Juliet. Then Lionel rang up Thomas McClary. Suspecting there would be other songs to write for the soundtrack, Lionel wanted his old friend involved in the project. When McClary asked him whether they should bring some tunes-in-progress to the meeting, Lionel told him 'Don't worry about it. We'll come up with something.'
Peters and Zeffirelli were devastated by Lionel's untitled theme, and quickly decided they must have it for the film. By the end of the meeting Lionel and McClary had also promised another song. On the elevator, going down, McClary hummed a riff he'd worked up. 'Lionel went right into the chorus. We got to the parking lot. I pulled my guitar out of the trunk and stated playing it'. 'Hey man', Lionel shouted, 'we've got it!' We laughed so hard. There we were again, feeling guilty and happy about having so much fun making music."

**jobeterob** · 02-27-2014, 02:57 AM

Originally Posted by supremester

Actually, he'd have nothing else to do with YOU. Because, like a certain idol of yours, are both degenerate liars. He never said he didn't like her or that she wasn't friendly. Here is the full, exact quote:

"Diana was the most aloof of all the Motown acts. You didn't have access to her. The Temptations or The Four Tops would hang out in the hallway but Diana didn't. She'd come out of her car, go straight into the studio....................... "She had a 40th birthday party and I got an invitation. My father couldn't believe it when I took him along and he came face to face with all these Motown legends."

When did he want nothing more to do with her exactly?
Was it after she didn't hang in the halls at Hitsville in Detroit in 1970?

Was it after he cut two tracks - including the biggest of his career with her in 1981?

Was it after she declined to record a follow up in 1982?

Was it after he went to her party in 1984?

Was it after he wrote and recorded the smash Missing You on her in 1984?

Was it after We Are The World in 1985?

Was it he cut two tracks on her in 1998 that she didn't include in an album yet?

Was it after he tried to get her to tour with him in 2009, 2010 & 2011?

WHEN exactly did he decide this - or was it after Flo interrupted Diane and monopolized the rest of the conversation giving clever and honest answers to the rest of Carson's questions?

No wonder you idolize her so much - you two are exactly alike and love making things up, exaggerating and misrepresenting facts in order to besmirch others. CLUE: If she is really as bad as you say, you two wouldn't have to make things up - you could just rely on the truth. Imagine that.....just telling it how it is - what a concept! It looks kind of desperate and crazy to be "inventful" when talking about other individuals - especially one you don't know. LOL!

Sugar Pie, Honey Bunch - you just can't help yourself!

Well, please excuse me but I have to go. [[Michelle Obama and I are having lunch on Pluto tomorrow and I have to pick out what she's gonna wear.) Goodnight xo

I am absolutely certain that Lionel decided he didn't like Diana when Marv forgot to take one of those pills he needs.

honest man · 02-27-2014, 07:03 AM

Originally Posted by jobeterob

I am absolutely certain that Lionel decided he didn't like Diana when Marv forgot to take one of those pills he needs.

Ha,has Marv left sdf ,what a shame if he has LOL

smark21 · 02-27-2014, 09:06 AM

NO, he just left this thread. But maybe Lionel is like Mary Wilson--an emotional masochist who wants to reunite with that sadistic Miss Ross so they can be on the receiving end of her horrid, evil diva behavior patterns? Of course she has sadly mellowed in recent years so they may be disappointed. Rumor has it that when she gushes "I Love YOu" she's actually being sincere!

**captainjames** · 03-01-2014, 03:18 PM

I think if Diana goes back in the studio again, Lionel, Valerie Simpson, HDH ans Michael Masser should be in her list.

**rovereab** · 03-01-2014, 04:45 PM

IMO, the lyrics of Endless Love are no more cheesey than some of the classic Marvin & Tammi songs, e.g. Your Precious Love.

Diana & Lionel also put in a great effort and, as said above, they sing the song to each other, much like Marvin & Tammi did.

Perhaps the negativity toward Endless Love is generated by its massive success at the time.

I was pleased to have Endless Love as the first song I danced to with my wife at our wedding reception. It may interest folk here that I surprised my wife with Marvin & Tammi's You're All I Need To Get By at our 25 anniversary party! For me, both songs have the same "certain something".

It would be fantastic if Diana & Lionel recorded together again.

smark21 · 03-01-2014, 05:46 PM

The Marvin/Tammi hits may have had some sappy lyrics, but the music had some edge to it. Endless Love is sappy in its lyrics and mushy in its music.

supremester · 03-01-2014, 06:09 PM

Part of my Endless Love issue might be because I was set up. I saw an article on the cover of Cash Box touting a just released, landmark single. Ditto Record World. I had never seen a 45 review as news on the cover of a trade mag. I was in NYC so I went into Colony Records - the rudest record store in the world, bought it and threw diva fits until they played it for me. Nothing. I just assumed it was more fluff Motown was issuing because she had switched to RCA. I played it for my ex and my NYC [[non Rosser) buds and no one heard a hit. A few weeks later, to my amazement, I heard it on the radio in Portland and it was announced as most requested. For a love song, the lyric is OK - I'm not a big fan of that genre, but I don't condemn romance tunes. I love When You Tell Me, for example. Of the Marvin/Tammi tunes - I don't find them sappy at all. They are pop songs written to sell 45s and they achieved their goal very well. Of course, it didn't hurt to have 2 of the greatest pop vocalists of all time to sing them, either.