By RODS (195.93.50.10) on Sunday, July 06, 2003 - 09:08 am:

Hello Terry,read your comment with some amusement. Er, I think you might find that drug taking was rather popular. I realise that maybe Keb gave the impression that sometimes it was difficult to dance for the dead bodies littering the floor but there does appear to have beem many deaths connected to the scene. I was talking to a guy in Stockport a few months back and it seemed everyone was dead. Very depressing. My wife tells me that of a crew from Burnley all are dead and that's around ten people. Ok they were there for the drugs but they were still part of the scene.
I don't know if the programme went out of it's way to sensationalise that aspect but if you ask Keb for his view then you're gonna get that part of what was happening at the time.
Yes the programme was bobbins as was "Soul" the other night. I missed another "In [At] the Club"
also abut NS. What did you expect. You cant cover a 35 year phenomena in 20-30 minutes and get every facet examined and explained.
I used to break in to Chemise shops but could never sell much. It's only now I realise I'd mixed up "underground" and "underwear" scene.

By Carl Dixon London (62.31.40.155) on Saturday, August 09, 2003 - 01:15 am:

Rods

looks like the Brits missed this topic. I agree, it is difficult to sum up a scene in half an hour. At least there was something, although some points laboured a little. I think if it was not so underground, it may get a little more airtime. There are some amazing politics in the Northern Soul scene.

I will watch out for you selling underwear down the market!

By FRANCIS T (195.92.168.173) on Saturday, August 09, 2003 - 12:18 pm:

FROM FRANCIS (TERRY) T

The Brits certainly did not keep their feelings quiet in the UK.I personally wrote a full page article in the recent Togetherness magazine ,and the current Manifesto has two correspondants trying to fathom the tv programmes out- basically critical of its content.I think the subject arose at the time things were "a bit shaky" for northern soul fans on the site and I for one stopped posting for a while.But that is history and it would be interesting to hear of positive views on the programmes.

PEACE AND REGARDS

FRANCIS T

By Carl Dixon London (62.31.40.155) on Sunday, August 10, 2003 - 04:36 am:

Francis T - I feel the positive thing is at least there is some cover and a mention here and there. I too have read some of the negative comments about the programmes and indeed, I was probably guilty of saying the same thing. It did paint a certain picture of the scene, which some people will take on face value. In Hull, we never had allnighters, so our clubs closed at 01:30hrs and that was it, unless you had passed your driving test and could afford a car to drive to Wigan, which indeed some of my chums did. I think someone mentioned on one of the threads that Northern Soul has become a social affair for fans in their 40's/50's these days and that alone shows how the scene is evolving. I had a comment from somebody recently on the lines of: if the younger Northern Soul DJ's were given a chance to spin the records, it would give impetus from a younger persons perspective and stimulate the scene. I recently went to a club in London and it was almost full, on a Wednesday night, but it missed the contribution of keen young people, hearing for the first time a certain record and scurrying off to the DJ to find out what is was called!

By MEL&THEN SOME (81.174.192.104) on Sunday, August 10, 2003 - 04:43 am:

The scene regards all-nighters today is all run by people and there various co-horts who are all the same boring lot(in general,not all)
I agree get some newer younger faces spinning the platters that matter.
mel.

By Carl Dixon London (62.31.40.155) on Sunday, August 10, 2003 - 05:07 am:

Then Mel, us folks who are in our 40's, can sit down, chew the cud, have a beer or two knowing that the scene would be in good hands for the future and we would always have somewhere to go and feel welcome. And from a Detroit angle, our own Mr Magic has a plan for recording some artists, and if and when it comes off, would be the next generation of record to be played on our scene. Easier said than done, I know, but old and new recordings will be played together at venues in the future, (well, that's the theory!!). Why should we deny young talent whether singers, songwriters, musicians or DJ's the chance to contribute to the great Northern Soul scene today? I feel it should evolve and encompass the very essence of the music more than the politics. Call me old fashioned, but I love to hear a young person ask me a soul question and I know the answer, then they accompany me to see SITSOM, then they suggest going to a Northern Soul gig! It is just waiting to happen�

By MEL&THEN SOME (81.174.193.83) on Sunday, August 10, 2003 - 07:01 am:

Carl
couldnt agree more mate.
But I only hope that the sounds that might be coming through that you mention still have that magical 60's feel about them.
Dont forget that the all-nighter scene is a dance scene first and foremost....
regards
mel(old but never boring)

By Carl Dixon London (62.31.40.155) on Sunday, August 10, 2003 - 07:10 am:

Mel - you are right on the money! No synths (apart from organ), live musicians, without samples and too many insert edits, vocals, without the use of the voice correctors which are used so much today. Mel, send me your email so I can send you something I feel could qualify over here, if produced correctly! Are you on broadband? My address is : carl.dixon(at)melkman.com replacing the (at) with @

By mel (81.174.193.83) on Sunday, August 10, 2003 - 07:13 am:

Carl
will be in touch
cheers
mel.

By FRANCIS T (195.92.67.208) on Sunday, August 10, 2003 - 12:47 pm:

It would be great if the more younger faces were involved in the northern soul scene.The modern side of the scene no doubt encourages a younger element,but it would be wrong to think the 60s 70s oldies scene would not welcome "new blood"Most northern soul folk are very friendly.As far as deejaying is concerned it is hard to break into the allnighter scene,as this is one area where the old soulboy factor comes in to play.If you played the Casino,Wheel,etc your chances of getting bookings increases as "names" sell tickets.Allnighter deejays therefore need rsomething special and this is often ownership of the rare (expensive} big sounds and a good knowledge of soul music.The other factor may be promoters giving bookings to other promoters , who will of course "bring a crowd" etc.What all this means is outsiders of ANY AGE will have little chance of getting on the nighter dee jay roster.It is easier for new blood to get on deejaying at a local event level,and build from there.
As far as the actual music is concerned,it would be great for new records,composers and so on to get a look in,but this would not ensure a younger involvement in the scene.As long as it lasts it will be based on old music and records many fine examples of which still remain unplayed.
From time to time a new record will find favour with dancers.Driza Bone Pressure springs to mind and a current 45 I am involved with by an 18 year old singer Leonie has to my surprise found favour with the northern crowd as well as the modern soul venues.Great but it won,t I think attract any younger dancers to the scene.
I hope the northern scene has a future ,but whatever its future it can stand proud as an important outlet for damned good soul music.

REGARDS
FRANCIS T

By MEL&THEN SOME (217.14.178.44) on Sunday, August 10, 2003 - 12:59 pm:

Francis
well said mate
I agree with everything you say
but personally I hate that Drizabone record.
There are hundreds of known/semi known sounds oldies and 60's newies that are never played on the scene.
There are loads from the Torch that only got spun around twice if that
as the sounds that were coming through was unbelievable at that time.
And a lot have never been heard of since.
regards
mel.

By Carl Dixon London (62.31.40.155) on Sunday, August 10, 2003 - 01:23 pm:

Francis - I am always thinking of ways to get the kids interested and feel there is mileage in some handsome or good looking teen group dressed smart, with a melody to die for, in true soulful fashion. My theory is once the kids see this, they know they can buy the CD's, hear them on the radio and most important, can see them perform. They would then be investigating the older sounds and dance venues (well, after some heavy marketing).

At least these days Northern Soul is more accessible with the Internet and digital radio stations. Who would have thought?

By FRANCIS T (195.92.67.68) on Monday, August 11, 2003 - 04:32 pm:

A funny tale that uk northern folks might appreciate.Last Friday a local venue (Lea Manor if anyone is interested) shared its northern night with a dance night in another room.Several younger people from the other venue looked into the northern room and commented that the dancing wasn,t trendy or something like.One or two looked curious.Then one girl and here mate said they fancied going in,but they asked what the sign NO TALC ON THE DANCEFLOOR meant.They got it into their heads this was a coded sign to keep their black friends out of the room.Obviously thats not funny ,but they would not believe any one should want to bring out talcum powder and throw it on the dancefloor.No amount of explaining it makes sliding steps easier would convince them.They went in in the end and soon got pissed off (sorry fed up} when they couldn,t dance with bottles of booze in their hands.I wonder if the generation gap can be bridged to reach the younger ones?Surely every body takes out talc to discos- and don,t the management love trying to get out of the grooves of the dancefloor.?
A bit of a wierd experience,but funny at ther time.

REGARDS FRANCIS T

By MEL&THEN SOME (217.14.178.104) on Monday, August 11, 2003 - 04:40 pm:

I always remember going to
an all-nighter at the Brick House in Wigan around 4/5 years ago now.
Anyway I got talking to a young guy and his Lady who were aged in there early 20's and were due to attend a rave that same night but it was cancelled.
They ended up rather curious in the brick and wondered what all this northern soul thing was all about.
During the night and even though the pair didnt know a thing record wise at the venue,
they were both up on the floor for most of the night.
After the venue ended I went back over to ask them what they thought of the whole night in general,
they were both amazed and really enjoyed the evening saying they would hopefully come to more venues and bring some friends.
Wether they did or not I dont know
but the music's there for them its just getting them in.
regards
mel.

By Carl Dixon London (62.31.40.155) on Monday, August 11, 2003 - 05:16 pm:

Similar thing last month at:

http://www.soul-a-go-go.demon.co.uk/sitcindex.html

It is a new venue, for an existing club. First thing to come out was the talc on the floor, but in addition some regulars had wandered in earlier and had no idea what was going to be played later. They did not have a clue what the music was, but they too, were on the floor best part of the night. The two waitresses, whom I explained what Northern Soul was, enjoyed serving and were dancing around the venue whilst changing the ash trays. Maybe that is a sign of the times.....

By FrankM (81.152.61.43) on Monday, August 11, 2003 - 08:48 pm:

As Northern Soul never hit Glasgow first time out in the seventies it has always been a young crowd who went to Goodfoot when it kicked off in 1991. The music was mixed nad included funk, Ska as well as Northern. I don't have time to write a treatise but in Glasgow today the older crowd ( born in teh sixties) started listening to the muisc as part of the mod revival. The younger crew came in in as it was trendy , maybe heard the music courtesy of older siblings and parents and found the clubs to be friendly hip and best of all unthreatening. There is a theory that neds (gangbangers to US readers)are unlikely to attend clubs where Northern Soul is played. They prefer 180bpm happy hardcore, rave tracks. Thus other young people find Northern Soul clubs to be safer.

By RODS (195.93.34.9) on Friday, August 15, 2003 - 12:48 pm:

I dont think the answer to any problems we individually perceive to be inherent in the Northern Scene is a mixture of younger people and "modern" soul.
The younger element I've noticed here and there seem to be with their parents. What kind of tossers like the music their parents like.
As for "modern" soul we've had this chestnut recurring throughout the scene's existence. Levine and his Exciters and NY disco, beginning of Stafford when we 60's guys re-asserted ourselves and now this 2000 R&B/Garage rubbish which in the main has put paid to crossover. Not to mention the same old 70's in Northern rooms.
My personal view is that there is a hardcore NS scene but it's been hi-jacked by the nostalgia freaks who want to hear stuff they heard when they stopped going back in 80's. It amazes me that these same people are the ones who take to stuff like Drizzabone and NF Porter.
Mel's got it right. Support djs who play something a bit different. Dont go to revival this and revival that. Support your local club and change it from within. Forget "Togetherness" and commercial rather than musical focus. If we dont next time the crowd leaves we wont have the nucleus to carry on.
I would add here that my view is based on the scene in the North-West. Maybe elsewhere it's different.